Topic: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

hello everybody
after spending 2 weeks on the road in England i thought a lot about the way most promoters treat bands and compared to the rest of Europe
i said MOST not ALL, that's very important!

England
no free drinks, shitty food - dinner & breakfast (lucky if you get both!), accomodation = floorspace in tiny cold flats, fees are lower than in mainland, ferries cost a fortune and everything is almost double more expensive...

Mainland
shitloads of free drinks, great food either take away or cooked on demand, wonderful breakfasts, comfy accomodations ( beds, large couches, sometimes entire private houses, hostels, B&B)

PS this isn't a criticism by any means, just a starting point to talk about differences among countries of the same continent. what do you think?

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

Mike - Persil Booking wrote:

PS this isn't a criticism by any means

er

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

Wow.

Feel ashamed England. You should be hiring out hotels for bands, your tiny cold flats just don't cut it

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

crikey.

free drinks?
hahahahaha

"the deadening futility of day-to-day life will be temporarily washed away in a flood of blessed and cleansing torment"

so what do vegans eat anyway?!

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

ha ha

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

I've been missing out not touring the mainland obviously, bring on '09. Cooked food, ON DEMAND

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

Mike - Persil Booking wrote:

just a starting point to talk about differences among countries of the same continent. what do you think?

Is Europe a country then?

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

I'd like to tour Europe sometime, I've had great reports.. but I can't compare yet sorry.
Touring on this island, I've had good and bad times/treatment, but I think if you're not prepared to feed yourself, experience discomfort, sleep in the van/on a floor and be thankful people have given you a place to play and a place to stay.... you shouldn't go on tour.

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

Mike - Persil Booking wrote:

hello everybody
after spending 2 weeks on the road in England i thought a lot about the way most promoters treat bands and compared to the rest of Europe
i said MOST not ALL, that's very important!

England
no free drinks, shitty food - dinner & breakfast (lucky if you get both!), accomodation = floorspace in tiny cold flats, fees are lower than in mainland, ferries cost a fortune and everything is almost double more expensive...

Mainland
shitloads of free drinks, great food either take away or cooked on demand, wonderful breakfasts, comfy accomodations ( beds, large couches, sometimes entire private houses, hostels, B&B)

PS this isn't a criticism by any means, just a starting point to talk about differences among countries of the same continent. what do you think?

If you payed attention to the differences between the way venues and promoters work in Europe instead of putting your feet up and indulging like a tit on "shitloads of free drinks", "comfy accomodation", and "wonderful breakfasts" then you'd probably be able to work it out for yourself.

10 (edited by elektra boogie 11-12-2008 20:06:30)

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

Mike - Persil Booking wrote:

hello everybody
after spending 2 weeks on the road in England i thought a lot about the way most promoters treat bands and compared to the rest of Europe
i said MOST not ALL, that's very important!

England
no free drinks, shitty food - dinner & breakfast (lucky if you get both!), accomodation = floorspace in tiny cold flats, fees are lower than in mainland, ferries cost a fortune and everything is almost double more expensive...

Mainland
shitloads of free drinks, great food either take away or cooked on demand, wonderful breakfasts, comfy accomodations ( beds, large couches, sometimes entire private houses, hostels, B&B)

PS this isn't a criticism by any means, just a starting point to talk about differences among countries of the same continent. what do you think?

Well for one, things being more expensive covers some of those points - and the ferries costing a fortune and the pricing isn't really anything to do with the promoters whatsoever.

Plus it completely depends on the venues you used here and in europe for it to be a worthwhile comparison - i know i've experienced both of the examples you are listing at home and in Europe.  But that's touring.

Bare in mind that a lot of promoters here really don't have the same kind of facilities that Europe does.  Touring in mainland Europe, we found that most cities or places we went had a fairly stable, reliable and large-ish scene of people who turn up to gigs - a lot of British cities don't have that, and its not really the promoters fault - most of them try incredibly hard to make the best of it.  Compare that with the venues too - the youth centres and social centres in Europe are complexes that are exceptionally rare in the UK for a number of reasons, behaviour of the police in shutting down attempts regularly, different local gov't actions, people's inclination etc.  So for example, I have gone to venues in Europe which have been former squatted social centres which now get local government subsidy with no interference - and rarely require any kind of venue "hire" fees etc.  These places are established and have the ability and money to give out drinks and food - particularly with beer, which is so so so cheap.  Compare that to England where most shows have to take place in bars by necessity - often with a room charge to cover and often with a local scene that is unpredictable in terms of turn-out.  I have no idea who you booked with here, but providing free drinks, two meals and even private accommodation (!!) is just completely out of the question unless there is a huge turn out.

Similarly for accommodation in general, some of the venues in Europe have places to stay built in, something we just don't have access to here.  British DIY promoters, just as mainland European promoters do, have to work real hard to get things to come off - but there are load of factors here which make that job really difficult.  Bearing that in mind, I'd be incredibly grateful for some people to put us on and give us a floor to sleep on - they do it by choice in often a hard atmosphere so I'd definitely feel pretty fucking bad if I was someone who had put whoever you brought over here on (was it Git Some?) reading this, and hearing my efforts poo-poo'd because they didn't live up to what you got in Europe.  Deal with it.

Nous ne voulons pas d'un monde ou la certitude je suis un pomme de terre de ne pas mourir de faim s'echange contre le risque de mourir d'ennui
T-I-M

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

Edgecrusher2k8 wrote:
Mike - Persil Booking wrote:

hello everybody
after spending 2 weeks on the road in England i thought a lot about the way most promoters treat bands and compared to the rest of Europe
i said MOST not ALL, that's very important!

England
no free drinks, shitty food - dinner & breakfast (lucky if you get both!), accomodation = floorspace in tiny cold flats, fees are lower than in mainland, ferries cost a fortune and everything is almost double more expensive...

Mainland
shitloads of free drinks, great food either take away or cooked on demand, wonderful breakfasts, comfy accomodations ( beds, large couches, sometimes entire private houses, hostels, B&B)

PS this isn't a criticism by any means, just a starting point to talk about differences among countries of the same continent. what do you think?

If you payed attention to the differences between the way venues and promoters work in Europe instead of putting your feet up and indulging like a tit on "shitloads of free drinks", "comfy accomodation", and "wonderful breakfasts" then you'd probably be able to work it out for yourself.

Absolutely bang on.

Nous ne voulons pas d'un monde ou la certitude je suis un pomme de terre de ne pas mourir de faim s'echange contre le risque de mourir d'ennui
T-I-M

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

Mike-please bear in mind anything that is provided for bands by the uk promoters, be it food or drink, in most cases, comes out of the promoters back pocket (in the hope that you can make the money back on the door). Most venues couldnt give a fuck about the bands or promoters, they're just letting you use their room so as more people spend money behind the bar. Thats why venues dont give bands free drinks and thats why in a lot of cases venues dont want people drinking their own alcohol in their premises.

If you expect a gourmet dish and loads of drinks then expect to receive less money than you're asking for.

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

Tiny cold flats...As somone who has slept in a very small van in the middle of winter and on a bench once, tiny cold flats are a luxury.

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

oooh lol

15 (edited by elektra boogie 11-12-2008 20:31:33)

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

I think the problem here is the word "treatment" as it makes it sound so so ungrateful.  Most of the factors you are describing are out of the hands of UK promoters and are therefore nothing to do with being treated well.  For a UK promoter who does what they can and gives you the only space they can, be that a cold floor in someone's flat or otherwise, just because they have decided to help your band out with a show, is pretty decent treatment.

Edit: And if your tour didn't go to Scotland/Wales, prepare for another backlash regarding your assumptions on "British" promoters' treatment.

Nous ne voulons pas d'un monde ou la certitude je suis un pomme de terre de ne pas mourir de faim s'echange contre le risque de mourir d'ennui
T-I-M

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

Mike - Persil Booking wrote:

i said MOST not ALL, that's very important!

Haha.

Good luck booking your next tour over here.

DIY minded recording in Leeds: www.suburbanhome.co.uk

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

Best thread ever.

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

I WANT MAH DINNAH KEWKED.

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

cool guy alert !

where is ralf ?

seriously, if you want "shitloads of free drinks, great food either take away or cooked on demand, wonderful breakfasts, comfy accomodations..." don't waste people time and stay at home .... i can name at least 10 places in mainland "worse" than your shitty statement here

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

Mike - Persil Booking wrote:

blah blah blah... and everything is almost double more expensive...

why ask if you already know?

what the fuck band/kind of band is this tool over here with anyway?

"murder and slavery are not subtleties and meat and dairy are not necessities"

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

thomas wrote:

what the fuck band/kind of band is this tool over here with anyway?

Vivian Girls??!?

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

Good gracious me what a load of cack. When I put touring bands on I invite them, often complete strangers, in to my house, cook them a meal, let them shower if they want, buy a box of beer and let them sleep over. The next day make cups of tea/coffee and toast and send 'em on their way. I spend at least £20-£30 on pasta, beer, bread, pasta sauce, fruit, milk etc plus making my house and its facilities available to em. If, and that is a big IF we make enough on the door, I take back a bit to cover my costs, but it is rarely if ever £20 or more. After all this when you get to the venue, set up, sit on the door all night, sort the bands out and so on and someone comes up to you and complains that they cannot get free beer at the bar the words "Why do I bother" spring to mind. Fortunately this has only happened once in over 10 years and the hundreds of other bands I've booked from abroad and the UK have been respectful and appreciated the efforts made to welcome them. From my experience this is how many of the DIY scene promoters work (though I've never been in a band, I have toured and travelled around with bands) and if I was in a band I would be bloody grateful and not bitch that the food wasn't up to scratch, the house was "cold" and the sleeping area wasn't "comfy". Fucks sake man.

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

Haha. Fucking hell. "Stuff costs a lot in your country, so why don't you give even more of it away for nothing than you already are?" Nice.

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

major lol

What a fucking moron

"I believe that it is possible for a person to be able to do what they want, aim for what they want, without the fear of what those around them might say....whatever you might choose to do in your life, make sure you make that choice yourself"

Re: England vs EUROPE. different ways of treating bands on tour

Mike - Persil Booking wrote:

no free drinks

drink water? it's free AND it tastes better.